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This is my last resort for a frustrating problem that I am certainly overcomplicating, but I don't have enough understanding to complete alone.

The problem goes like this:

Consider a space station immobile in a given $(t, x, y, z)$ coordinate system. At $t=0$, three spaceships leave a space station with velocities $\bar{v}_A = 0.8c\hat{x}$, $\bar{v}_B = -0.6c\hat{x}$, and $\bar{v}_C = 0.7c\hat{y}$. Write the worldline of the station and each spaceship in the $(t, x, y, z)$ coordinates, as a function of parameters $\lambda_{S,A,B,C}$. Choose your $\lambda_X$ parameters so that they are all $0$ at $t = 0$.

Spaceship A waits for a time $\Delta t'_A$ after launch (measured in its own reference frame) before emitting a brief pulse of light. Consider the events corresponding to spaceships B and C receiving the pulse of light. How are they causally related (i.e. is one in the future of the other, or are they causally disconnected)? What is the proper distance (if spacelike) or proper time (if timelike) between them?

Normally calculating the interval $(\Delta s)^2$ between two events isn't difficult, but the worldlines for each ship are parameterized with different $\lambda$s and I know that in order to determine whether they are time/spacelike I need to calculate the interval but this single problem is enough to make calculating it very difficult.

For reference, I have the worldlines in the frame of the station S $(t,x,y,z)$:

$W_S = (\lambda_S,0,0,0)$

$W_A = (\lambda_A, 0.8c\lambda_A,0,0)$

$W_B = (\lambda_B, -0.6c\lambda_B,0,0)$

$W_C = (\lambda_C, 0,0.7c\lambda_C,0)$

and (after a Lorentz boost) in the frame of A $(t',x',y',z')$:

$W_S' = (\frac{5}{3}\lambda_S,-\frac{4}{3}c\lambda_S,0,0)$

$W_A' = (\frac{3}{5}\lambda_A,0,0,0)$

$W_B' = (\frac{37}{15}\lambda_B, -\frac{7}{3}c\lambda_B,0,0)$

$W_C' = (\frac{5}{3}\lambda_C,-\frac{4}{3}c\lambda_C,0.7c\lambda_C,0)$

I also calculated the time it takes for the pulse to reach B and C in A's frame as well as how long it takes for B and C to receive the pulse in their own frames (using time dilation):

$\Delta t_{BA}' = \Delta t_A' + \frac{|W_B'^x|}{c} = \Delta t_A' + \frac{7}{3}\lambda_B$

$\Delta t_{CA}' = \Delta t_A' + \frac{|W_C'^x + W_C'^y|}{c} \approx \Delta t_A' + \frac{3}{2}\lambda_B$

In B's frame: $\tau_{BA} = \frac{\Delta t_{BA}'}{\gamma_{BA}}$

In C's frame: $\tau_{CA} = \frac{\Delta t_{CA}'}{\gamma_{CA}}$

I have a feeling that I am messing something up by still having the $\lambda$s in my time calculations, but I'm not sure if I should substitute a time (maybe $\Delta t_A'$?) into each worldline to compute the time in A's frame or if I've missed something else.

Any help on how to calculate the interval between B and C would be greatly appreciated! I believe I can calculate proper time/distance after that on my own.

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  • $\begingroup$ Either you choose to write all the parameters in terms of the station's time and work exclusively in that, or you choose all the parameters to be their own proper time. I think the former is way easier to work with than the latter, but it is up to you to choose. $\endgroup$ Commented Sep 9 at 2:57
  • $\begingroup$ @naturallyInconsistent I suppose what is confusing me the most with this problem is that I don't know how to write all the parameters in terms of S's time. For example, do I set $\lambda_{S,A,B,C} = t$? Is that valid? If so what utility did marking them as different $\lambda$s have? It seemed like a strange thing to do to me when I first read the problem. My intuition for these parameters is that they are the "speed" at which an observer at rest moves along their worldline. So the idea that each ship has their own "parameter speed" is disorienting. Though I don't know if that's right. $\endgroup$
    – null_set
    Commented Sep 9 at 3:07

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wait--:

$$ W_S = (t, 0, 0, 0)_S $$ $$ W_A = (t, v_At, 0, 0)_S $$ $$ W_B = (t, v_Bt, 0, 0)_S $$ $$ W_C = (t, 0, v_Ct, 0)_S $$

The pulse is emitted at $\Delta t'_A$ -- which occurs in $S$ at:

$$ \Delta t_A = \Delta t'_A/\gamma_A \equiv a $$

which is:

$$ E_A = (a, v_A a,0,0)$$

To find where that intersects $B$, which occurs at $\Delta t_B\equiv b$ (in S), so the event is:

$$ E_B = (b, v_B b, 0 , 0) $$

such that:

$$ (E_A-E_B)^2 = (E_{A, t} - E_{B, t})^2 - (E_{A, x} - E_{B, x})^2 - (E_{A, y} - E_{B, y})^2-(E_{A, z} - E_{B, z})^2 = 0 $$

since the emission and detection are light-like separated in all frames. So:

$$ (E_A-E_B)^2 = (a-b)^2 - (v_A a-v_B b)^2 = 0 $$

Solve $b$ in terms of $a$, and then do the same for $W_C$ to get $E_C$, then work with $E_B$ and $E_C$ in frame $S$ to get $\Delta s_{BC}$, which is a Lorentz invariant.

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  • $\begingroup$ This certainly seems better than the weird norm stuff I was doing with the worldlines and seems straightforward. Thank you! $\endgroup$
    – null_set
    Commented Sep 9 at 3:42
  • $\begingroup$ @null_set staying in just one reference frame and doing everything in terms of it, is generally the easiest way to do most SR stuff. This was what I was hinting to you in the comment earlier. But the question is somewhat suggesting that you do $$\begin{align}\tag1W_S&=(\lambda_S,0,0,0)\\\tag2W_A&=(\frac53\lambda_A,\frac43\lambda_A,0,0)\end {align}$$ and so on. The point of doing this is that all the $\lambda$ will then be proper times, so that you can insert $\lambda_A=\Delta t^\prime_A$. However, this is going to be far more cumbersome, so just ignore this. $\endgroup$ Commented Sep 9 at 4:03
  • $\begingroup$ If you're dealing with events, which are just points in $M_4$, it's easy to work in any an all frames, but when you have world lines (esp. if they're not inertial), I've found getting the time coordinates to work a little difficult--but maybe that is the point of the problem, with the introduction of $\lambda_j$ of your choice---to learn how to do it? $\endgroup$
    – JEB
    Commented Sep 9 at 14:55
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    $\begingroup$ @JEB I talked to my professor and he basically said that since each world line is traversed at a different rate, the different $\lambda$s are needed so I’m sure that he was just preparing us for worse scenarios where each world line is not affine. $\endgroup$
    – null_set
    Commented Sep 10 at 15:12

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