Timeline for Why the macroscopic approach towards studying matter in classical thermodynamics only applicable when number of constituents are large?
Current License: CC BY-SA 4.0
9 events
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| Sep 15, 2022 at 9:21 | comment | added | Tobias Fünke | @Themis Indeed, that's my point: Even for a non-interacting system you need to consider large systems in order for thermodynamics to apply. I may have misunderstood your first comment, tho. And if so, just ignore my comment(s). You're right that (obviously) interactions do not play a role for the ideal gas; but still you need a large system to apply concepts of thermodynamics. | |
| Sep 15, 2022 at 9:21 | comment | added | Tobias Fünke | But the Sackur-Tetrode equation only holds in the thermodynamic limit, no? Cf. What good is the thermodynamic limit?. D.F. Styer. | |
| Sep 15, 2022 at 9:20 | comment | added | Themis | @JasonFunderberker Yes, but thermodynamics works only in the thermodynamic limit. | |
| Sep 15, 2022 at 9:13 | comment | added | GiorgioP-DoomsdayClockIsAt-90 | @JasonFunderberker Using the correct Boltzmann formula for entropy the ideal gas entropy is an extensive quantity (see it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equazione_di_Sackur-Tetrode ). | |
| Sep 15, 2022 at 5:49 | comment | added | Tobias Fünke | @Themis But even for an ideal gas, the entropy is not extensive before taking the thermodynamic limit. | |
| Aug 29, 2022 at 14:10 | comment | added | GiorgioP-DoomsdayClockIsAt-90 | @Themis The ideal gas is a special system, so it is not general enough. I agree that a convincing and general treatment of fluctuations involves Statistical Mechanics. But Equilibrium Thermodynamics has a validity independent of Statistical Mechanics. Classical thermodynamic equilibrium systems do not show measurable fluctuations. Then, that becomes the proper domain of Thermodynamics. | |
| Aug 29, 2022 at 12:05 | comment | added | Themis | Regarding the wall effect, that's true, but what about an ideal gas with no interactions? This leaves us with fluctuations as the answer, but where do fluctuations come from? My point being that we cannot avoid statistical arguments if we want to give a qualitative but still somewhat convincing answer. | |
| Aug 29, 2022 at 5:13 | history | edited | GiorgioP-DoomsdayClockIsAt-90 | CC BY-SA 4.0 |
Added an initial paragraph on the scope of the answer and a final sentence about small small systems
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| Aug 28, 2022 at 22:46 | history | answered | GiorgioP-DoomsdayClockIsAt-90 | CC BY-SA 4.0 |